Johnson vs. Thune

IN THIS EDITION

Thune-Johnson rifts belie next big tests: Funding, health care

Georgia’s messy Senate GOP primary isn’t going away

The Vault: Crypto has some regulatory asks for Trump

Cocktails & Conversation

THE TOP

Thune-Johnson rifts belie next big tests: Funding, health care

Happy Thursday morning.

News: Rep. Brian Fitzpatrick (R-Pa.) huddled with Speaker Mike Johnson on the House floor Wednesday night to talk about Russia sanctions. Fitzpatrick is considering filing a discharge petition to bring a sanctions bill to the floor. Senate Majority Leader John Thune said Tuesday he’s ready to move the Senate’s sanctions measure but argued it must originate in the House for procedural reasons.

Johnson has lost two discharge petitions in recent weeks, so he’s probably eager to avoid another one.

Thune vs. Johnson. Tensions between the Senate and House are as old as time. And it’s not unusual for the Senate majority leader and House speaker to be at odds, even when they’re from the same party. Much of it stems from the differences in rules, procedures and culture between the two chambers.

Yet Senate and House Republicans are buzzing this week about two high-profile schisms between Thune and Johnson, whose relationship has seen relatively few cracks up to this point.

On Tuesday, Thune roundly dismissed Johnson’s push for the Senate to amend legislation mandating the release of the Jeffrey Epstein files. Within the span of a few hours, Thune also rebuffed Johnson on a controversial provision allowing senators to sue the Justice Department if their phone records are obtained. After Thune defended the measure, the House unanimously passed a bill to repeal it on Wednesday night.

“There’s no daylight between us,” Johnson said in a brief interview. “Sometimes he and I both get frustrated with the other chamber’s rules and processes and procedures and peccadillos. I regard him as a good friend and a trusted partner. We’ve had a great leadership run together. And there’s no daylight between us. So we’re working all that out.”

It was notable, and perhaps unfortunate, that these splits occurred almost simultaneously. Both Thune and Johnson, along with their allies, say their relationship remains strong and they don’t foresee any ripple effects. The pair had their weekly meeting on Wednesday.

“I understand there are different ways of doing things… but for the most part, I would say we have an incredibly strong working relationship,” Thune said.

Indeed, the pair has beaten back some serious headwinds throughout the year, including sticking together amid the government shutdown and passing the “One Big Beautiful Bill Act.”

But there are several flash points in the coming weeks that could make the Epstein and DOJ payout rifts look tame.

Rough road ahead. First, it’ll be a major challenge to negotiate and pass the rest of the full-year funding bills by Jan. 30. The Senate’s topline spending figure is much higher than the House’s number. The three full-year funding bills signed into law last week are typically regarded as the easiest to pass — yet they almost fell off the rails several times.

On health care, Thune has committed to putting a bill on the floor by mid-December, while Johnson hasn’t promised anything. If the Senate passes a bill to address the immediate threat of rising Obamacare premiums with sufficient GOP support, Johnson will be under tremendous pressure to take action in the House.

And there are strategic divisions about the value of passing another party-line reconciliation bill, as many Republicans are pushing to use that as the vehicle for a health care overhaul.

So while both camps are downplaying this week’s drama, the dynamic between the two leaders could be starting to shift.

Inside the split. Thune has always been careful not to publicly criticize, undermine or otherwise diminish Johnson. The South Dakota Republican not only rebuffed Johnson twice this week, he seemed remarkably comfortable doing so.

Thune’s allies in the leadership blame Johnson for, in their view, pretending to speak for the Senate majority leader.

For example, Johnson said on Tuesday that he was “very confident” the Senate would amend the Epstein bill, citing a conversation he just had with Thune. And last week, Johnson said he was “very angry” about the DOJ payout provision, adding that Thune told him over the phone that he “regretted the way it was done.”

In both cases, Thune made very clear how he felt about those issues. And it didn’t line up with Johnson’s characterizations. This set the stage for the public splits.

Yet the House’s unanimous passage last night of legislation to repeal the DOJ payout language puts new pressure on Thune, who’s already under fire from House Republicans and many GOP senators — including Senate Appropriations Committee Chair Susan Collins (R-Maine) — who felt blindsided.

Also … Cherfilus-McCormick indicted. A federal grand jury indicted Rep. Sheila Cherfilus-McCormick (D-Fla.) Wednesday on charges of embezzling $5 million in disaster funds.

The indictment alleges that Cherfilus-McCormick, along with several co-defendants, received an overpayment of Covid-related disaster funds and then funneled a large portion of the money toward her campaign.

Cherfilus-McCormick was elected in a 2022 special to fill the seat of the late Rep. Alcee Hastings (D-Fla.) by a mere five votes and won reelection later that year.

Rep. Greg Steube (R-Fla.) said he’d file a motion to censure Cherfilus-McCormick and remove her from all committees. This will be the fifth rebuke effort in the House this week.

Cherfilus-McCormick isn’t the only Democrat under indictment. Rep. Henry Cuellar (D-Texas) was indicted in May 2024 on a series of federal corruption charges. Rep. LaMonica McIver (D-N.J.) was indicted on federal assault charges earlier this year after a confrontation during an ICE detention facility protest.

One more thing. We scooped in Wednesday’s PM edition that Johnson and House Intelligence Committee Chair Rick Crawford (R-Ark.) banned Rep. Dan Crenshaw (R-Texas) from government-funded international travel after an episode that involved alcohol in Mexico.

— Andrew Desiderio, Jake Sherman, Laura Weiss and Ally Mutnick

December Event: Join us for a conversation with Senate Appropriations Committee Chair Susan Collins (R-Maine) on Thursday, Dec. 4, at 9 a.m. ET. We’ll sit down with Collins to discuss the news of the day and the future of Alzheimer’s disease diagnosis and treatment. RSVP!

PEACH STATE POLITICS

Georgia’s messy Senate GOP primary isn’t going away

The Georgia Senate GOP primary is devolving into bitter infighting, prompted by a string of controversial ads that are catching the attention of party leadership.

But don’t expect an end to the messiness anytime soon.

Speaking on the Georgia political beef, Senate Majority Leader John Thune said that “until we have a nominee, we’re not able to engage fully in that race.”

Translation: Party leadership isn’t getting involved in the primary and is planning on letting Rep. Buddy Carter (R-Ga.), Rep. Mike Collins (R-Ga.) and Derek Dooley fight it out until May 2026.

“Primaries tend to get competitive,” Thune said. “But we still think in Georgia, once the dust settles there and the smoke clears, that that’s gonna be a really good opportunity for us.”

The back and forth. First, a Gov. Brian Kemp-linked nonprofit ran an ad earlier this month attacking Carter and Collins for the government shutdown. Kemp has endorsed Dooley, a former college football coach making his first run for elected office.

The top Senate Republican campaign groups condemned the ad — which lumped Carter and Collins together with Democratic incumbent Sen. Jon Ossoff (D-Ga.) — as a distraction from their stance that Democrats were to blame for the shutdown.

Dooley’s primary opponents were similarly angry.

“[That ad] did get people upset. It’s unfortunate that we’ve got some of our own doing the Democrats’ dirty work,” Rep. Buddy Carter (R-Ga.) told us. “It was very disappointing.”

The Republican campaigns also sparred on Veterans Day. Collins’ camp released a social media video that started with a tribute to military service before attacking Dooley for his history of not voting. Dooley hit back and accused Collins of “using Veterans Day to score political points.”

This is exactly what Republicans feared would happen when Kemp, the party’s preferred candidate, passed on running for the Senate seat in May.

Collins’ campaign also drew heat last week for pushing a deepfake ad featuring a deceptive edit of Ossoff. The video raised alarms in the state and even drew criticism from Dooley’s camp.

“The Republican field is a mess, but I’m running like I’m behind,” Ossoff told us.

The Money Game: Dooley raised $1.9 million in Q3, Collins raised $1.1 million in his campaign — plus a further $800,000 in his victory fund — and Carter raised $940,000. Ossoff raised $12 million in the third quarter and has $21 million on hand.

— Max Cohen

PUNCHBOWL NEWS EVENTS

Cocktails & Conversation

On Wednesday night, we hosted Cocktails & Conversation, an event featuring networking, light bites and a fireside chat about the future of online learning for youth.

During the event, Punchbowl News Founder and CEO Anna Palmer sat down for a conversation with Education Through Music’s Stephanie Nantell and YouTube’s Global Head of Youth & Learning Katie Kurtz. Thanks to YouTube and Google for partnering with us on this event.

Raising a glass: Rep. Marc Veasey (D-Texas); Parul Desai and Johanna Thomas of the House Energy & Commerce Committee; Krislyn Tatum of Rep. Debbie Dingell’s (D-Mich.) office; Sean O’Neil, Ja’nique Jules, and Domenica Echeverria of Rep. Jim Himes’ (D-Conn.) office; Chris Garcia of Rep. Herb Conaway’s (D-N.J.) office.

Rick Wade of the U.S. Chamber of Commerce; Hastie Afkhami of S-3 Group; Laura McPherson of T-Mobile; Scott Mulhauser and Marisol Samayoa of Bully Pulpit International; and Vanessa Khachane, Erica Arbetter, Dean Kowalski, and Denna Nazem of YouTube.

AND THERE’S MORE

News: A new report on health savings accounts is dropping today.

Expect Democrats to seize on it to make their case against the tax-advantaged accounts as a solution to the Obamacare cliff. Some Republicans are pushing to scrap the expiring enhanced subsidies for ACA plans and provide funding through HSAs instead. But Democrats aren’t sold.

The U.S. Government Accountability Office analysis says HSAs for high-deductible plans have been more beneficial to higher-income groups and those in excellent or very good health.

Ways and Means Committee Ranking Member Richie Neal (D-Mass.) requested the report. Neal called HSAs “just another tax break for the wealthy.”

Also, Rep. Sharice Davids (D-Kan.) is leading dozens of House Democrats calling on Speaker Mike Johnson to hold a vote on whatever health care product the Senate passes.

Special Election. MAGA Inc., a pro-Trump group, just poured a ton more money into a special election in a deep-red Tennessee district — a sure sign Republicans are growing nervous about the race.

The group’s total investment hit $1 million yesterday, per FEC filings. It is spending on TV ads, text messages and GOTV efforts to boost Army veteran Matt Van Epps. He faces Democratic state Rep. Aftyn Behn in the Dec. 2 special.

— Laura Weiss and Ally Mutnick

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